[p4] FW: Perforce VS latest .net source control solution

Shawn Hladky p4shawn at gmail.com
Tue Jul 11 08:24:46 PDT 2006

I had a chance to see several demos and participate in a few hands-on labs
at TechEd a few weeks back.  My conclusion is that TFS is a really immature
product, and very feature poor at this point.  It doesn't even have a
stand-alone gui client... everything must be accessed from Visual Studio.
Outside the branch/merge features, I wouldn't even recommend it over VSS.
Check out the FAQ of TFS, which points out many of the lacking features:

It does look like it has very similar branch/merge features as Perforce...
but I didn't dig too deep on some of the border cases that seem to have
quirks in every SCM system.

As a few people mentioned, the licensing is really squirrelly.  The server
license is $2800, but every user must have one of the Team System licenses.
Most of those are in the neighborhood of $4500/user (plus $2000/year
subscription after 1st year).  Granted that gives you a lot more than just
source control...  It's the TFS CAL (which is also issue tracking) plus MSDN
professional plus a bunch of other tools.  That's still $2000 more than just
MSDN Pro, which is what most MS shops already have.  And the new Express
editions (free) can handle quite a bit of .Net development.

On the flip side, it does seem that there are a lot of resources at MS
working to make it successful.  There are already a number of 3rd party
add-ons, including a multi-platform java GUI and CLI client.  That's a good
sign that its very extensible.  If MS keeps up the effort, it may very well
be a strong contender by version 3 or 4.

On 7/11/06, Ron Gafron <rong at gsb.com> wrote:
> Mornin' all,
> I can't say that I've done a real in-depth analysis of that, but I did
> take
> a look at the MS solutions earlier this year before we decided on
> Perforce.
> So, here's a couple of thoughts (opinions only)....
> If you want to use the new SCM solution from MS, you'll need to buy into
> the
> whole Team Edition system; I don't think it's available separately.  Team
> Edition is aimed at larger corporate environments, in my view.  It is
> quite
> expensive if you're a smaller shop.  Perhaps large developer environments
> are able to handle the cost more easily.  We decided against Team Edition
> on
> the basis of cost, and the fact that it had a lot of really nice features
> that I'm not sure we'd ever use.
> That led us back to VSS vs Perforce.  I think Perforce is a superior
> product
> from a technical basis.  However, our main reason for going to Perforce
> was
> the available support.  As far as I can tell (and I am by no means an
> expert), there is little, if any, technical support available for VSS.
> Could be that you can get tech support if you buy into one of Microsoft's
> support programs, but those are pretty expensive, too.  In any event, the
> tech support I've gotten from Perforce is 2nd to none. They are an
> outstanding group of folks, in my estimation.  Support for VSS ended up
> being a treasure hunt in Googleland, at least for me.
> Let me offer one last thought on product comparisons.  I find this to be a
> very difficult thing to do on an objective basis.  It's possible to do a
> nuts and bolts and cost comparison, of course, but in my experience,
> whether
> a product will be a success for you is determined more by your corporate
> culture.  Some products lend themselves to certain kinds of environments
> and
> not others.  I played with Perforce for months before making a final
> decision.
> Ron Gafron
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Barry Au-Yeung [mailto:barry_au_yeung at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 6:11 PM
> To: perforce-user at perforce.com
> Subject: [p4] Perforce VS latest .net source control solution
> All,
>   Has anyone evaluate the latest source code solution from .net? Whats the
> name of it?
>   I heard there are significant improvements compare to the VSS.
>   I want to obtain the detail comparison.
>   Any comments?
>   Thank you.
>   Barry
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