[p4] P4V vs. P4WIN

[Zoltan Grose]

> The first and critical indicator is the level of Intuitivity - and  
> here P4V fails.
>

I'd be interested to hear some examples. Sometimes familiarity breeds  
bias. I've never had a problem tracking down a perforce feature  
through the p4v UI.

I find p4win fails 100% in my environment because I'm on an OSX  
machine. =)

-z

On Apr 15, 2007, at 6:12 AM, Sheizaf, Yariv wrote:

> Hi Jeff,
>
> P4V is usable - many users work with it, and as you said, if they  
> do not know P4Win they maybe like it.
>
> However, when compare P4V and P4WIN with competitive tools GUIs  
> (Starteam SurrondSCM, ClearCase, some CVS Windows UIs, etc.), the  
> typical rating is:
>
> 1. P4WIN
> 2-... - some competitors
> N-1 to N - P4V and maybe another one competitor.
>
> The first and critical indicator is the level of Intuitivity - and  
> here P4V fails.
> This is necessary in order to sell the product to people who have  
> high skills in other tools usage.
>
> I know at least two companies that installed Perforce with P4V for  
> evaluation, did not find "their legs and hands", took another tool  
> for evaluation and bought it (even in all technical parameters  
> Perforce was better). It never happened in my country with P4WIN,  
> and I tell about more than 20 sites that chose Perforce with my  
> consultancy.
>
> In the last two years the stability and performance of P4V  
> improved, but they still not in the level of P4WIN.
>
> Regards,
>
> Yariv Sheizaf
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Jensen [mailto:jeffjensen at upstairstechnology.com]
> Sent: א, אפריל 15, 2007 3:32
> To: Sheizaf, Yariv; perforce-user at perforce.com
> Subject: RE: [p4] P4V vs. P4WIN
>
> Your assertions are strong, and would be best supported with examples.
>
> 1.5 years ago, I sold/rolled out Perforce at another customer (a 52  
> user
> purchase).  For GUI, I completely ignored P4Win, and used P4V  
> exclusively.
> It was very successful; not "hard" and not "problematic" as you assert
> below.
>
> I am still working at that customer, and users really like P4V's  
> features.
> Perhaps the reason is they had no exposure to P4Win, so they had no
> preconceived notions as to how it should work.
>
> I also know P4Win well.  6 years ago, I rolled out my first Perforce
> installation, and used P4Win.  It was good, worked well, users  
> liked it.  I
> still think it is fine.  Once you mentally divorce your mind from  
> it, P4V is
> also good.
>
> While P4V needs continued improvement as most software, from my  
> experience,
> it is far from unusable and problematic, as you infer.
>
> I am particularly interested in your examples, as then Perforce can  
> see them
> and improve P4V based on your experience.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: perforce-user-bounces at perforce.com
> [mailto:perforce-user-bounces at perforce.com] On Behalf Of Sheizaf,  
> Yariv
> Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2007 1:43 AM
> To: perforce-user at perforce.com
> Subject: Re: [p4] P4V vs. P4WIN
>
> Hi,
>
> P4WIN is intuitive, P4V is NOT.
>
> P4Win is almost 100% stabilized and always with very HIGH performance,
> while P4V is not.
>
> Unix oriented users install P4win on their PCs, use the AltRoot option
> and work from P4win because P4V UI is problematic.
>
> The great "revision graph" is included in P4V installation, but if you
> install both you get it also in P4win.
>
> And, if you should sell Perforce (to real new customers) or "internal
> sell" (to your company developers) - it always succeed with P4WIN,  
> very
> hard if you give them P4V.
>
> Regards,
>
> Yariv Sheizaf
>
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